About the WYWH Experience 2CD and Immersion box Wembley live performance

[shuffle]

After all this time, I compared the three WYWH Immersion box soundboard tracks with the audience recording source to listen if they were really from 15th November.
Then a surprising fact was discovered.
The SOYCD and YGBC are 100% identical to the audience recordings from 16th show. These are not from 15th show.
Only R&D matches the performance from 'Black Holes In The Sky (GDR)'.
So I think it can be said that multi-track tapes of both days' performances have been properly archived. Has anyone mentioned that?

Shine On You Crazy Diamond - 16 November 1974
Raving and Drooling - 15 November 1974
You've Gotta Be Crazy - 16 November 1974

[Skinny12]

Didn't they say anything "frankenstein" the drums due to a missing track/channel?

[ammoj2]

Didn't they say anything "frankenstein" the drums due to a missing track/channel?

Yes I think it was Nick's kick drum that was mic'd badly so they used a sample for the kick drum.

[shuffle]

Didn't they say anything "frankenstein" the drums due to a missing track/channel?

I remember reading that article too. I thought that was a recording problem with tape of the 15th performance only.
But in fact the tape of the 16th performance was also used, which deepens the mystery.

[OrlandoSimmo]

Hey everyone,
this is my first post on R and D.
The multitracks 100% exist from both the 15th and 16th. I had a detailed explanation on Y, but now that’s gone YGBC uses mainly the 16th with a few vocal/instrumental passages from the 15th, particularly when roger sings. I think this is because Roger’s vocal mic was so close to the drums that swapping just the vocal track on the 16th with the 15th would result in obvious drum bleed (I’ve tried similar things with my bands live recordings and the bleed tends to be an issue). This is similar for SOYCD and R&D, again mainly for instrumental passages.

The kick drum microphone was poorly positioned on the 15th (this is evident in some photos from the Wembley gigs). The drum was likely picked up but severely muffled. To fix this I’m assuming they took several kick drum samples from the 16th and patched it into the 15th.

The more I listen to the Wembley shows the more details i notice. For example, in us and them (multitracks from the 15th), the audience mics are slightly ahead of the rest of the instruments, which unfortunately results in an annoying doubling effect on the drums. David’s vocal swaps from the 16th also create a slight “drum bleed” problem.

I also find it odd how the only live recording they release from the mid 70s, happens to be the one with uninspiring performances (I don’t think that, but the band said that about the Wembley gigs) and Nick Kent’s highly critical review. Kind of ironic IMO.

[Chorale]

That was the "Official Wembley 74 DSOTM Sources" thread on Y - it's in the archive so it'll appear here eventually.

[Alan]

I guess this is it:
https://ravinganddrooling.com/forum/...940#post273940

[TheMoebLoop]

Hey everyone,
this is my first post on R and D.

I also find it odd how the only live recording they release from the mid 70s, happens to be the one with uninspiring performances (I don’t think that, but the band said that about the Wembley gigs) and Nick Kent’s highly critical review. Kind of ironic IMO.

Welcome, OrlandoSimmo!

I happen to agree with that assessment of the performance; I don't pay much attention to TDSOTM performances, but, listening to the first sets of Wembley 15th and 16th, then listening to the 17th, Stoke, Manchester and Bristol, it seems to me that all of the latter are more inspired and varied renditions of SOYCD, RAD, and YGBC than the former. Of course, this is just my opinion, but it really seems sad that it is 15th and 16th November 1974 the shows to have been officially recorded.

BTW, was "You Gotta Be Crazy" ever "You've Gotta Be Crazy", or is it just a typo that keeps cropping up for reasons I cannot explain? Surely, "You've Gotta Be Crazy" is a strangely ungrammatical title for a group not known to engage in playful use of language, isn't it? I certainly never heard of it being introduced or sung as such.

[shuffle]

Thank you OrlandoSimmo for your detailed explanation.

I wonder what source was used to patch Dave's vocal part on Brain Damage?


I think the best performance of the British Winter Tour is the Bristol show on December 14, 1974.

[OrlandoSimmo]

I am pretty sure that Dave’s vocal is on both audience recordings. Maybe the live sound engineer didn’t have David’s vocals going through the sound system but still had them recorded to tape, which is indeed possible since muting and volume changes done effect what goes onto tape.

[Anredeon]

Maybe they should have record the 17th Wembley too, as this could be my British Winter Tour favourite. What happened on the 14th? Nobody recorded that?

[OrlandoSimmo]

Okay, the bootlegs from the 15th & 16th of November do indeed have David's vocals during Brain Damage however, they don't seem to exist on the BBC tapes. That mystery is unfortunately out of my sound engineering knowledge for the time being, but I'm sure if I knew all about how their sound system works and exactly how the BBC/multitracks were recorded, I could probably give you all an answer.
I hope that answers your question.

I could also go on for ages about the officially released, BBC, & bootleg Wembley content, and what changes were made for the official releases. I've even considered writing a documented report about it, but the Wembley content has been discussed enough already.
I don't think the 14th was recorded simply because Brian Humphries was called into record and mix their set from the 15th onwards. The 14th is also deemed to be the worst Wembley date according to Nick Kent and the band themselves.
ALSO, the GGITS piano intro is till a mystery.

[OrlandoSimmo]

Can anyone confirm if Wembley was recorded on a 16 or 24 track tape machine? And how are there no obvious cuts during the recording due to the limited tape time? Did they have two tape machines set up so they didn’t have to change tapes?